High Density Polyethylene Plastic Waste Research Articles

Study on the behavior of pulling power and flammability of mold walls mixed with high-density polyethylene plastic waste

Currently, materials used in construction have been continuously developed in terms of quality and efficiency, especially fiber reinforcement in mortar, a form of development used in construction. The development aims to enhance concrete's tensile properties and performance for higher flexibility. Most plaster walls are ordinary mortar and have low elasticity, which is a weak point. Therefore, attempts are being made to improve their properties by using a rigid material as a concrete mixture, namely high-density polyethylene plastic, to increase its ability to bear tensile force. This study examines the tensile strength and flammability tests of walls plastered with mortar, with which high-density polyethylene plastic waste is mixed. The tensile strength of mortar plaster walls mixed with high-density polyethylene plastic is tested by replacing at 2.5%, 5%, and 10% proportions and cured at 7, 14, and 28 days. By comparing general mortar and high-density polyethylene plastic mortar, it is found that the general mortar had the highest tensile strength at 28 days of curing. The obtained value is 45 ksc, and the mortar mixed with polyethylene plastic in the amount of 2.5% at 28 days of curing can withstand the strength of 45 ksc. In addition, the general mortar can produce the same tensile strength as mortar mixed with high-density polyethylene plastic. The flammability test shows that general mortar develops red marks after being burned with fire, while the mortar combined with high-density polyethylene plastic develops black marks. However, neither type of wall is in flames nor spread.

The Evaluation of the Use PET and HDPE Plastic Waste as Coarse Aggregate of Lightweight Concrete

The use of goods with plastic-based materials is familiar to society in general. Good for wrapping food, drinks, groceries, and others. Because of so much use, the problem of plastic waste cannot be avoided. Therefore, the purpose of this study is to overcome environmental land problems due to plastic waste. This research focuses on how to apply PET (Poly-Ethylene Terephthalate) and HDPE (High Density Polyethylene) plastic waste to concrete mixtures. PET plastic waste that has been chopped is then heated until melted then poured into molds and allowed to cool and harden. Then crushed and substituted as much as 5%, 10%, 15% and 20% replace the coarse aggregate to improve the characteristics of concrete. The results showed that the use of PET and HDPE in concrete resulted in decreased fill weight, lighter concrete weight, reduced compressive strength, and gave an optimum value of tensile strength at a variation of 10%. The use of PET plastic has a greater absorption value than HDPE, while the tensile strength value of PET is smaller than HDPE. Overall, it is concluded that PET and HDPE plastics have a big role in reducing the problem of plastic waste in the community

The Effect of Recycled High-Density Polyethylene (HDPE) as an Additional Binder in Porous Asphalt Pavement

Porous asphalt has excellent permeability and larger air voids. Due to the low stability strength of asphalt binder with aggregates, Malaysia uses porous asphalt roads for lightweight vehicle road transportation. Numerous studies indicate utilizing Recycled High-Density Polyethylene in porous asphalt road surface. As a result, it was utilised as an additional binder material to enhance the asphalt binder. The main purpose of this study is to investigate the stability of modified porous asphalt samples and evaluate the optimum percentage of HDPE plastic waste from 3%, 6% and 9%. The aggregates, asphalt properties, Marshall Parameters and waster absorption test are in comply with JKR Standard and PWD 2008. At 3% of plastic addition has improved the stability of porous asphalt specimens. Adding plastic waste as a binder helps strengthen asphalt binding.

RANCANG BANGUN MESIN HOT PRESS LIMBAH PELASTIK SERTA PERHITUNGAN KONSUMSI ENERGI PENCETAKAN

The issue of waste, particularly plastic waste, remains a challenging problem without a definitive solution. Plastic waste, especially that made from High-Density Polyethylene (HDPE), takes an extensive amount of time to decompose. Currently, plastic recycling machines are priced in the hundreds of millions, making them less accessible. Therefore, there is a need for affordable machines that function effectively alongside existing ones. This research introduces a hot press machine for recycling HDPE plastic. The hot press machine is capable of recycling HDPE plastic waste and offers the advantages of being portable, compact in size, and cost-effective. Following the design phase, the machine is capable of producing plastic boards with a thickness of 1 cm, utilizing 3.7 kg of plastic, and requiring a molding time of 2 hours and 15 minutes at a pressure of 4.36 MPa.Subsequent testing involved analyzing three factors to determine the significant influence of factor A (heating temperature) and factor B (heating time) on energy consumption. The goal was to identify the interaction that yielded the smallest average energy consumption.

Characteristics of artificial coarse aggregate from High Density Polyethylene (HDPE) plastic waste for highway flexible pavement

Aggregates are a major component of hot mix asphalt and make up about 85% of the total mix volume. The increasing expansion of road infrastructure in Indonesia has led to a depletion of aggregate resources. Conversely, Indonesia is one of the largest producers of plastic waste in Southeast Asia. The aim of this study is to evaluate the potential of high density plastics (HDPE) for use as artificial aggregate material in flexible road pavements. The parameters investigated include softening and melting point, penetration and elongation index, gradation value, specific gravity, absorption and abrasion of the aggregates. The investigations into the physical properties of the artificial aggregates revealed a softening point of 265°C and a melting point of 272°C. The penetration index was 0.77% and the elongation index was 0.70%. The classification values passing through the 3/4" sieve were 100%, 66.88% for the 1/2" sieve and 25.96% for the 3/8" sieve. The specific gravity of the artificial coarse aggregate was 1.629. The absorption of the artificial coarse aggregate was 1.270% and the abrasion value was 0.15%. In summary, the artificial coarse aggregates produced from HDPE plastic waste can serve as a partial substitute for natural coarse aggregates.

Tensile and Flexural Properties of Recycled HDPE for Application in Building Products

Plastic waste generation is a major environmental threat with farreaching consequences that needs to be dealt with. High density polyethylene (HDPE) is a common plastic waste coming out of daily household products. Recycling of HDPE plastic waste has been a viable alternate to disposal. To the best of author’s knowledge, no work has been reported on the material properties of recycled HDPE in perspective of building products. This study investigates the tensile and flexural properties of mechanically recycled HDPE for potential application in building products. The specimen’s behaviour under loading has also been reported. Based on the findings, 2.5% elongation at fracture was observed having 14.25 MPa strength against tension. Whereas, 32.6 MPa modulus of rupture was obtained with toughness index of 1.45 against flexure. In addition, potential application of recycled HDPE for manufacturing building products has been discussed keeping in line the material properties of recycled plastic. The adoption of recycled waste material instead of conventional materials can significantly influence the construction industry positively.

Liquid fuel production from high density polyethylene plastic waste

This research aims to determine the effect of heat exchanger diameter variations on the volume and physical properties of fuel derived from plastic waste. The plastic waste is converted using the thermal cracking method, which involves heating the raw material without oxygen. This process produces charcoal and oil from the gas condensation in the heat exchanger. The type of plastic used is High-Density Polyethylene (HDPE) waste. The variations of heat exchanger diameter used are 1/2inch, 3/4 inch, and 1 inch. The physical properties investigated include density, viscosity, and heating value. From the test results, it was found that density of the oil fuel produced from plastic waste decreased with increasing heat exchanger diameter. However, the volume and heating value of the fuel produced increased. Generally, the physical properties of plastic pyrolysis oil produced from the thermal cracking process of plastic waste resemble those of gasoline

Analysis of the influence of additional plastic waste (HDPE) as Mixed Asphalt AC-WC on Marshall Parameters

<p>Flexible pavement structures that use asphalt as a binder are currently the mainstay of the Indonesian people because of their large load-bearing capacity and economical construction costs. One type of flexible pavement used is asphalt concrete with the top surface layer or Asphalt Concrete Wearing Course (AC-WC). The use of asphalt from the petroleum refining process is one of the problems because its availability is decreasing. However, the condition of the road pavement which has a limited life requires periodic repairs to maintain the condition of the road. In addition, there are also problems regarding the processing of plastic waste which is still not optimal. Based on data published by the National Waste Management Information System in 2020 as much as 18.3% of the total waste generated. This figure increased by 2.3% from the previous year. Sukoharjo Regency also experienced an increase in sales of plastic waste by 1.16% from 14.04% (in 2019) and now to 15.20% (in 2020). Plastic is one type of polymer in the thermoplastic polymer group which is processed by organic chemical compounds. One type of plastic that is often used is High Density Polyethylene (HDPE) which has strong, light and flexible properties that can soften at a temperature of 130-137"℃" and harden again if. In this study, HDPE plastic bag waste was used as a pure asphalt substitute with variations in the proportion of substitution of 2%, 4%, 6%, 8%, 10%. Where this study aims to analyze the effect of adding HDPE plastic waste as a mixture of AC-WC asphalt on asphalt parameters. From the research conducted, the use of asphalt content of choice is 5.7%. With the results of the mixture with HDPE asphalt mixture HDPE has increased with the addition of variations of HDPE. The flexibility of HDPE asphalt mixture decreased according to the flow meter reading. At a content of 2% HDPE has the largest percentage of VIM, flow, and proportion of VMA, but has the lowest value and percentage of VFB. The best range of HDPE content is in the percentage of 4%-6% because it can increase the value of a more flexible mixture and optimal asphalt absorption. The use of HDPE plastic waste is an alternative in waste treatment and can reduce the use of asphalt. It can be concluded that HDPE plastic bags can be used as an alternative to bitumen substitutes that meet the requirements of Bina Marga 2018 Revised 2nd Edition.</p>

Performance of Asphalt Concrete Pavement Reinforced with High-Density Polyethylene Plastic Waste

This research investigates the possibility of using high-density polyethylene (HDPE) plastic waste to improve the properties of asphalt concrete pavement. HDPE plastic waste contents of 1, 3, 5, and 7% by aggregate weight were used. HDPE plastic waste=stabilized asphalt concrete pavement (HDPE-ACP) was evaluated by performance testing for stability, indirect tensile strength, resilient modulus (MR), and indirect tensile fatigue (ITF). In addition, microstructure, pavement age, and CO2 emissions savings analyses were conducted. The performance test results of the HDPE-ACP were better than those without HDPE plastic waste. The optimum HDPE plastic waste content was 5%, offering the maximum MR, ITF, and pavement age. Scanning electron microscope images showed that the excessive HDPE plastic waste content of 7% caused a surface rupture of the sample. Improvements in the pavement age of the HDPE-ACP samples were observed compared with the samples with no HDPE plastic waste. The highest pavement age of the HDPE-ACP sample was found at an HDPE plastic waste content of 5% by aggregate weight. The CO2 emissions savings of the sample was 67.85 kg CO2-e/m3 at the optimum HDPE plastic waste content.

Recycle Ability of Post-Consumer Recycled Plastic (PCR) from the Chlorine Tank

Plastic waste that used in our daily life is a major problem of environmental contaminate because it produces microplastics after degradation resulting in the harmful of living organisms, including humans. Therefore, this research has an idea to solve this problem by recycling the plastic waste. High density polyethylene (HDPE) plastic waste from the chlorine tank in fishing industry is considered. This work was designed to blend it with virgin HDPE plastic pellets. The ratio of blended plastics between virgin HDPE pellets and HDPE plastic waste from the chlorine tank which was defined as post-consumer recycled plastic (PCR) was 100:0, 50:50, 40:60, 30:70, 20:80 and 0:100 wt%, respectively. The result shows unchanged thermal properties of plastic blends caused by the same type of polymer, thus the PCR without blending with the virgin HDPE plastic is selected for recycle ability studies. The PCR was rerun in the twin screw extruder in the range of 0 - 80 extruded recycle time to observe the thermal, rheological, mechanical, and physical properties. It was found from our result that 20 recycling time of PCR was appropriate for maximum recycling process due to slightly change rheological characteristics, mechanical properties as well as product’s color.
 HIGHLIGHTS
 
 Thermal properties of post-consumer recycled plastic (PCR) after recycling and its blending with virgin HDPE
 Rheological change of post-consumer recycled plastic (PCR) after recycling
 Mechanical and physical properties of post-consumer recycled plastic (PCR) after recycling to meet a customer need
 
 GRAPHICAL ABSTRACT

Development of Leather Cutting Board from Plastic Waste

Cutting is the process in which goods or garment material are cut and converted into pattern shapes of the goods or garment components. There are two methods of Leather cutting, which are hand cutting and machine cutting. Hand cutting is done with the use of hand knife, cutting board and cutting patterns. Machine cutting can be done using semi-automatic cutting machines or fully-automatic cutting machines. Currently, in Ethiopia, different local and foreign investors are participating in leather products manufacturing. Most of the leather product manufacturing industry and some Small and Medium enterprise’s (SME’s) in the country are using leather cutting machines in order to cut leather goods or garment parts. Most of the industry and SMEs are using imported cutting board made of plastics and rubbers. However, these cutting boards are expensive.
 
 This research aimed at developing a cutting board made from HDPE (High-Density Polyethylene) plastic waste as main material, calcium carbonate as a filler and glass fiber as a reinforcing material. Primary and secondary data gathering techniques were applied simultaneously. Primary data were collected through interview and field observation. Secondary data was gathered by reviewing different literature. The cutting board developed through collecting HDPE plastic waste, washing, shredding and melting the shredded plastic with filler and reinforcing material. The melted plastic poured in to cutting board mold and cooled. The developed cutting board was compared with HDPE cutting board available in the local market. The developed board showed relative compression and hardness properties with the HDPE cutting board available in the market. In the cost analysis, the developed cutting board is cheaper than the cutting board which available in the market. However, the cutting board in the market has better surface texture and quality than the developed cutting board. Melting HDPE plastic waste using metal or clay cooking pots and charcoal fire is a tedious task and smoke from the fire will cause human health problem and will affect environment. Consequently, manual plastic melting method is not feasible for mass production, because it is difficult to control the amount of heat (charcoal fire) during melting process. Based on this the authors recommend using machine based plastic melting and molding during HDPE and related plastic recycling.

Compressive strength, sound absorption coefficient (SAC) and water absorption analysis of HDPE plastic waste reinforced polystyrene and Portland cement for lightweight concrete (LWC)

This project research presents compressive strength, sound absorption coefficient (SAC) and water absorption analysis of High-Density Polyethylene (HDPE) plastic waste reinforced polystyrene and Portland cement for lightweight concrete (LWC). The research is aimed into the issue of waste materials such as HDPE plastic waste and polystyrene waste into lightweight concrete (LWC) application. Modifications with waste material may improve the qualities of lightweight concrete (LWC), and HDPE plastic waste may serve as a partial substitute for natural aggregates, which are rapidly depleting. It has been proposed that HDPE plastic waste and polystyrene be used as an alternative aggregate material to reduce environmental impact. In this study, four composition ratio of HDPE plastic waste reinforced polystyrene and Portland cement to produce LWC; which are (a) 0.5 HDPE plastic waste : 1.0 polystyrene: 1.0 Portland cement, (b) 1.0 HDPE plastic waste : 1.0 polystyrene : 1.0 Portland cement, (c) 1.5 HDPE plastic waste : 1.0 polystyrene : 1.0 Portland cement, and (d) 2.0 HDPE plastic waste : 1.0 polystyrene : 1.0 Portland cement. The highest rate of compressive strength attained was 97.28 kN with the composition ratio of 1.5 HDPE plastic waste: 1.0 polystyrene : 1.0 Portland cement. It was discovered that a larger proportion of plastic lowered the strength of concrete. On the other hand, the optimum composition ratio of HDPE plastic waste reinforced concrete for lightweight concrete (LWC) produces the appropriate strength for LWC when the composition ratio is optimized. For sound absorption analysis, the higher coefficient is 0.42 SAC at 350 Hz to 1500 Hz for the composition ratio of 1.5 HDPE plastic waste : 1.0 polystyrene : 1.0 Portland cement. Water absorption characteristics of HDPE plastic waste and polystyrene for LWC dropped with increasing plastic waste content up to 0.50%.

Production of Briquettes from a Blend of HDPE (High Density Polyethylene) Plastic Wastes and Teak (<i>Tectona grandis </i>Linn<i>. </i>f) Sawdust Using Different Natural Adhesives as the Binder

HDPE (High Density Polyethylene) is one type of plastics that has been used in many various applications. We frequently used it in our daily life, such as plastic bag, dairy products packaging, etc., which often end up being waste, which is non-biodegradable. This plastic waste has good potential to be used in production of briquettes because it has a high heating value. Teak sawdust is also considered waste and usually not properly utilized. Nevertheless, it has a high heating value and sufficiently low level of volatile matter. Therefore, mixing HDPE plastic waste with biomass charcoal such as teak sawdust to make briquettes as an alternative domestic fuel is an interesting idea. The objective of this research was to make briquettes by mixing HDPE plastic waste and teak sawdust. The effects of two different natural adhesives (i.e. rice flour and corn flour) and the ratio of plastic waste and teak sawdust were investigated. The results of the experiment show that the best ratio of plastic waste and teak sawdust that produce the best quality of briquettes in this study was 50% : 50% and by using rice flour adhesive. The following are the results for this sample, the duration of fire starts to ignite was about 2.3 minutes; the duration of fire boils 125 mL of water was 12.8 minutes; and the duration of the briquettes burn to ashes was about 62 minutes.

Experimental investigation of concrete incorporating HDPE plastic waste and metakaolin

This paper deals with the investigation of using Metakaolin and HDPE plastic waste with various percentages in concrete to make the concrete economical with desired properties and to reduce the consumption of naturally available construction materials. Six percentages of High Density Polyethylene (HDPE) Plastic powder (5%, 10%, 15%, 20%, 25% and 30%) and 10% metakaolin are incorporated with the weight of fine aggregate and cement respectively. The concrete with 10% metakaolin and 15% HDPE plastic powder gives better result on compressive strength in comparison with conventional concrete. The flexural strength and split tensile strength of concrete shows up to 80% and 90% replacement with 10% metakaolin and 5% HDPE plastic powder respectively.

Solar assisted pyrolysis system for High-Density polyethylene plastic waste to fuel conversion

Plastic products are used almost in all our daily life activities due to their characteristics such as being inert, durability, flexibility, and versatility. More than 1 million tons of plastic wastes are generated daily in Ethiopia. Unless managed it properly plastic waste affects the environment immensely since they are durable and stable. Plastic wastes stay in the environment for a long time. In this paper, a solar-assisted pyrolysis system has been designed and tested for the generation of liquid fuel from High-Density Polyethylene plastic waste. Data were collected related to the solar energy potential of Addis Ababa city of Ethiopia and the amount of plastic waste generated daily. Proximate and ultimate analysis and heating value of waste were determined experimentally. The energy requirements of the pyrolysis system were determined and the sizing of the system was performed. The model is simulated using Matlab software and a mathematical model is applied to study the performance of the system. A 4 m diameter solar parabolic dish collector with a cylindrical-shaped reactor at the focal point and dual solar tracking system is used based on Addis Ababa weather data and the required energy for the endothermic pyrolysis. Based on the result, the conversion efficiency of the system is 72% by weight. The result also shows 1360 Kwh/m2 of solar energy is required to produce 14.2 liters of liquid fuel from High-Density Polyethylene plastic waste. The heating value of the produced liquid fuel is 41.8 MJ/kg. Thus, by using a solar-assisted pyrolysis system a liquid fuel has been produced from plastic waste, income is generated from the selling of the produced liquid fuel, and the environmental impact of waste plastic is reduced.

Fabrication and testing of Composite tile made from plastic waste and mineral admixture for aggressive environments

Abstract The use of polymer composites in highly aggressive environments has compelled to focus the present work on enhancing the performance characteristics through matrix modifications, by incorporating suitable fillers. The present work discussed is about fabrication of tile from composite material of High Density Polyethylene (HDPE) plastic waste and fine graded Wollastonite powder as mineral admixture. Major concern of this work is to reduce the plastic waste and recycle into useful industrial products and the development of high strength and durable material which can be used in coastal & marine structures. In addition to this, they can be used in sewage systems prone to alkali attack. The main aim of this study is to know the consequences of varying the filler in HDPE polymer composites. For that purpose we have prepared a Compression Mold and fabricated specimens of composite tile of HDPE plastic waste and Wollastonite powder. Experimental investigation was carried out to study the durability and mechanical properties of the fabricated composite tile and the results obtained from these tests are comparable with the properties of ceramic tile. The compressive strength of the composite tile obtained is as high as 24 MPa and Durability properties of these tile shows that this can be used for aggressive severe environments which are prone to Corrosion.

Comparative Study of the Chemical Compositions of Liquid Fuel from Thermal Cracking of Low and High-Density Polyethylene Plastic Waste

The increase in the rate of accumulation of plastic waste (PW) has been of great concern to the world especially in the developing countries due to its non-biodegradable nature and improper waste management practices. Hence, efforts towards the conversion of this waste (PW) to resourceful materials have led us to the exploration of pyrolysis (anaerobic thermal cracking) of plastic waste under a controlled condition to produce liquid fuel. A stainless steel batch reactor was used in the cracking of the low and high-density polyethylene (LDPE and HDPE) plastic wastes into liquid fuel components at a temperature of 230°C. The liquid fuel obtained from the pyrolyzed LDPE and HDPE was analyzed using GC-MS. Fifty (50) compounds each was identified for both LDPE and HDPE which revealed the presence of mostly alkenes and aromatics in the hydrocarbon ranges of C8 – C24. This is made up of 36% of gasoline fractions range from C6 – C12, 32% of diesel fractions range C13 – C20, and 14% oil of residual fuel range of C20 – C28 and 18% of non-hydrocarbons was discovered for the HDPE while 36% of gasoline fractions range of C6 – C12, 34% of diesel fractions range C13 – C20, oil and 12% residual fuel range of C20 – C28 and 18 % of non-hydrocarbons was discovered for the LDPE. There is little or no difference in the products of pyrolysis of light and heavy polyethylene plastic waste.

High density Polyethylene plastic waste treatment with microwave heating pyrolysis method using coconut-shell activated carbon to produce alternative fuels

Pyrolysis is a technology that could crack polimer such as plastic waste into alternative fuels. This research uses microwave heating methode, which more efficient than conventional heating methode. The plastic waste used is 200 grams of HDPE, with feed to catalyst weight ratio are 1:1, 0.6:1, 0.4:1. Pyrolysis was run at temperatures of 250, 300, 350, & 400 °C for 15, 30 and 45 min. From the experimental result, the best variable of pyrolysis process with microwave method is at 45 minutes, at 400°C, and 1:1 feed to catalyst weight ratio. Result shows that yield of liquid and gas product is 99.22%; yield of residue is 0.78%; value of liquid product’s composition (cycloparaffin and n-paraffin) is 54.09% and concentration of methane gas is 10.2%.

Improvement studies on emission and combustion characteristics of DICI engine fuelled with colloidal emulsion of diesel distillate of plastic oil, TiO2 nanoparticles and water.

Experimentation was conducted on a single cylinder CI engine using processed colloidal emulsions of TiO2 nanoparticle-water-diesel distillate of crude plastic diesel oil as test fuel. The test fuel was prepared with plastic diesel oil as the principal constituent by a novel blending technique with an aim to improve the working characteristics. The results obtained by the test fuel from the experiments were compared with that of commercial petro-diesel (CPD) fuel for same engine operating parameters. Plastic oil produced from high density polyethylene plastic waste by pyrolysis was subjected to fractional distillation for separating plastic diesel oil (PDO) that contains diesel range hydrocarbons. The blending process showed a little improvement in the field of fuel oil-water-nanometal oxide colloidal emulsion preparation due to the influence of surfactant in electrostatic stabilization, dielectric potential, and pH of the colloidal medium on the absolute value of zeta potential, a measure of colloidal stability. The engine tests with nano-emulsions of PDO showed an increase in ignition delay (23.43%), and decrease in EGT (6.05%), BSNOx (7.13%), and BSCO (28.96%) relative to PDO at rated load. Combustion curve profiles, percentage distribution of compounds, and physical and chemical properties of test fuels ascertains these results. The combustion acceleration at diffused combustion phase was evidenced in TiO2 emulsion fuels under study.

Experimental Investigation on Thermocatalytic Pyrolysis of HDPE Plastic Waste and the Effects of Its Liquid Yield over the Performance, Emission, and Combustion Characteristics of CI Engine

An experimental investigation was carried out to study two process parameters of thermocatalytic pyrolysis of high density polyethylene (HDPE) plastic waste, and the liquid yield of pyrolysis (plastic oil) was analyzed over its working characteristics in a direct injection compression ignition (DICI) engine. A series of pyrolysis experiments with four different heating rates (5, 10, 15, and 20 °C/min) were performed in identical environments with the objective of analyzing the heating rate and residence time on end products. It was found that the liquid yield was maximum at the heating rate of 10 °C/min and the residence time decreases with an increase in the heating rate due to variation of reaction kinetics at different heating rates. The characterization of the plastic oil revealed that the major constituents belong to alkene, alkane, and alcohol functional groups; totally 90 six fuel range hydrocarbons were present ranging from C5 to C28, and the other thermophysical properties were comparable with th...